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The Devs have asked the community about Utility in Ashes of Creation. Most people have talked about Non-combat related utility but in this video, I want to discuss how combat based utility has gone too far in other MMORPGs and I don’t want Utility in Ashes of Creation to get out of hand! If you like the video, then HIT THAT LIKE BUTTON, SHARE IT with your friends! Also, let me know in the comments if you like this kind of content for Ashes of Creation. Subscribe to this channel and thanks for watching! And I’ll see you… in the next one!
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What is Ashes of Creation?
Ashes of Creation is a unique take on the MMO experience. Our world structure is dynamic and built to react to the actions of our players. Cities will rise and fall, their populations based on the history of the world as the players create it. Quests will unlock as these populations gather, their needs grow, and secrets are unlocked. As the world’s NPC structure is established in real time, players will have the ability to destroy what they’ve created, paving the way for new development, new populations, and real change. Political strife and intrigue will play a very real role in the structure of your world. Gone are the days of static worlds, change is here to stay.
Risk Vs Reward
All across Verra, you have the opportunity to experience massive warfare, participate in epic trade caravans, and gather valuable components to craft exquisite items. Not only will your fellow players be your adversaries; the creatures of the land and the very environment itself will pose a constant and fresh challenge. Will you siege castles to become royalty, defeat other guilds to showcase your prowess, shape the marketplace by being a successful trader, or earn renown by developing your artisan crafting skills? This is your story, you tell us!
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I like the idea you brought up of choosing utility vs damage.
I like the idea of no direct passive abilities as they will come from nodes, relegions, and guilds. The idea of choices in talent tree is a good one. I would also like to see multiple choices within that line, but only one can be on the bar. This will give you an option depending on your group and situation. But make the utilities make sense for that character.
Choises between offensive damage on the tree or mitigation. Further options within one of the choices, but only one can be used and changing them will be on cooldown as well as the duration.
Nice job brother. The video came out great 🙂 We're going to discuss this on the show tonight!
As someone who loves playing support classes, I am totally cool with DPS getting the poop end of the spectrum for utility. If you're going to have support classes in your game, then you have to design them so they can't just be replaced by everyone choosing a bard augment.
Tanks and healers deserve some utility because they're managing the mobs or their party in some way. Their job isn't to do damage, but to setup the damage dealers for maximum output and to prevent death with buffs, CC, taunts, heals, shields etc.
Great video, brother. I'm sure they'll find that sweet spot. Gonna take a lot of testing.
I love to tank and heal in MMOs. I hope class design isn't over complicated in AoC. Here is hoping for a great tank class!
Great video, fully agree
Great video. Solid work friend.
The key to having the Bard, and indeed all classes, being an Intigral and Essential part of any and every party is to have skills that STACK with other classes. Two mages simply refresh the same effect on the target, while having a bard (and/or any other class) use a similar skill STACKS. This will require groups to be diverse in Archetypes and make all classes Essential. Bards able to heal (< Cleric, but > AoE), ranged Magic Dam (<Mage, but >AoE), melee physical damage (<DPS). I believe the summoner should have more mana than any other class, as well as faster mana recovery than any other class, and its' spells should cost more mana than any other class's. This would make them (combined with the mage's ability to pool and share mana in a party (As seen in Log Horizon)) a mana battery (immensely important for any Raid or adventuring group). As for utility skills, the main point you were trying to make, I agree that non-support classes should be SEVERLY limited in these. As a DPS Rogue, I want my SUPPORT to SAVE ME from CC… otherwise what's the point of a support class? ((other than the points I've already made, which might be enough but not really)). Where the rogue might CC one target on a long cool down, the mage might CC a group of targets on the same cool down, where a support might CC that same group on a shorter cool down. Each only having ONE cc skill, but that skill's timer and AoE being the TRUE mitigation of how much utility that class really has. Playing with the number of skills is moot, we must also consider many other factors (what if one class's CC also did DoT). The entire point is the concept and intent. And I believe your Intent was ON POINT, DPS (I AM ONE) should have almost ZERO utility, Healers (healing aside) and Tanks should have limited utility, and Support classes should have LOTS of utility (reduced cool downs, increased AoE).
Great vid man. Keep em coming….or else.
Great vid as per usual
I like the ideas and hope AoC can provide something new to really make this the MMORPG we have wanted since our early days playing WoW. Retail WoW is too far down the rabbit hole for me to ever play it again. I did enjoy revisiting WoW Classic for a while but it is just a raid logging situation after the launch periods. I would love to get back into a real MMORPG again like AoC is attempting to pull off. I love what I have seen so far from Intrepid Studios & Steven's direction/theory. My fingers are crossed for this game to be live sometime in 2025. Keys to an AoC victory: #1 Great combat feel/look/depth (the hard part) #2 NO PAY TO WIN/SKIP EVER! #3 A real world/story to explore that grows in depth as we go along. #4 Leadership & developers that are able to listen/react/explain to its players and quickly fix major issues/bugs. #5 DO NOT allow the game/community to be dictated by mandatory 3rd party addons/logs that you eventually have to balance the entire game for (like Warcraft has been for a decade) . #6 Please do something to minimize botting/RMT. #7 They better get a good game live well before the League of Legends MMO rolls out or they may be in serious trouble. I will play this game for 10+ years if they can pull most of these things off.
Once again it really depends on the type of utility, it comes in many different forms. And remember, they only need to really configure 8 classes worth of utility, once you pick you second archetype to complete your class you wont gain new abilities, so it really depends once again on what the augment system will actually look like. How much will it change those utility abilities. And if class design continues down the route we have already seen then I'm sure we will see many familiar spells and abilities from games we have already played. So utility has already been kind of figured out for Intrepid. We've seen the cleric prevent death spell from priests in wow, the mage cone of cold to slow and cc, the bear trap from New World and WoW, the ranger get out of jail ability is basically every pvp trinket from wow, the pull and knock down from the tank has been in a ton of games. They haven't exactly rewritten the book on utility. The bard description from Stevens leak sound very close to the dancer from FFXIV or the augmentation Evoker from wow, but I agree with you that bards and summoner should have a lot of utility.
And I don't recall anyone from intrepid saying "you suppose to feel weak by yourself". While I realize Ashes is going to have a ton of group based content I don't think saying your character sucks on its own is a good selling point. 🤣
Great point to discuss. I don't have enough MMO experience to weigh in, but I can relate to the fear of having too much utility that I won't ever need to reach out to other players. Its one of the basis for Ashes, we will need others to thrive in the world of Verra. They are gonna strike a good balance in the end. I have faith.
Generally, I would agree with your argument, especially in regards to starting at low powered and having each class/specializations offer a specific utility, be it combat related or not, that simply cannot be found in one of the others.
I think there should be 2 classes that specialize in utility that being the Rogue and Ranger, the rest should be very, very limited. My hope is each class will have a very specific specialization to bring the group. Tank is tank (obviously) , Cleric is heals, Bard is buffs, Fighter is mdps, Mage is rdps, Rouge melee CC, Ranger is ranged CC, and Summoner, well Summoner I have no clue what specific role it should play.
They need to make utility special. Each spec should have some niche role they fill — Utility should come at the cost of damage or survivability. Some classes need to counter other classes/roles. They need to allocate a point system to abilities, and things like utility vs durability vs damage output are all things that should eat up a total of points a single spec can have. That way if you have high damage, you should have to give up utility or durability etc etc.
Ranged abilities should also be really expensive on that point allocation. I think this is key to world pvp/bigger battles.
As someone who typically prefers DPS, I'm also happy with less universal utility. I just want to feel like my choices in build matters.
Great video, you bring up some valid points. I think the main thing is retaining that Rock/Paper/Scissor gameplay. Steven has already said that the game wouldn't be balanced around 1v1, which I'm happy about. Players need reasons to socialize and group up to round out their capability.
If you make classes too unique with much wanted abilities that are required for content, then you might have a problem with a healthy player population to do content. People will not play what you give them. They play what they like. If you don't have universal abilities for utility or support, then it'll be like Everquest. You have a long wait time because no one plays a game that is too unforgiving because you need this or that.
Wow is popular because most people are more casual and prefer being able to do things. A game is not hard or challenging because you have extremely unique classes. It's hard because you include dynamic features and punishing game play mechanics. You can balance class roles around this. How many games have been released with unique this, that, and hard game play? They always run into issues with a healthy player population.
As a supoort/ healer I often times find leveling to be terrible other than spamming dungeon finder. I love the idea of support classes being actual support classes but leveling without damage is brutal. I agree that it would make me want to play with a dps but I don't want to have to lfg to run an MSQ.
Great video. I am a new player to mmos. I started my 1st mmo GW2 recently. It has at least 5 weaponn skills and 5 utilities all the time. and i am already feeling overwhelmed by how many buttons i have to press. especially playing in action combat mode
I may be being overly optimistic, but my expectation is that every archetype will be essential for group play in the majority of situations. If an archetype proves not to be essential, then it should be removed or replaced with some archetype that is. My first choice is Bard and my second is Cleric, because my current understanding is that they will be in demand and fun and complex to play. For that to be true, both must have unique skills that groups cannot do without, which means that all of the archetypes must be distinct and focused on their individual role, rather than being "one size fits all" modern MMORPG classes. Every player should not have variations of every skill. This will mean an adjustment to normal play styles and strategies. I think that this is a good thing.